Home › Forums › Weather & Weather Stations › XCSkies – RRFS

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  • #24824
    David Webb
    General Member

    For you XCLies enthusiasts, the new RRFS model has been added (this is the new model set to replace NAM, which is being retired). Interested to see how it stacks up against the others.

    Screenshot 2026-10-16 at 8.45.14 AM

    #24830
    David Webb
    General Member

    Small sample size, but RRFS was pretty close in calling yesterday (when checking the day before). There also seemed to be pretty close agreement on all 3 of the more reliable models (NAM, HRRR, and RRFS).

    #24831

    Last year I recorded all major forecasts for most of the flyable days, and added the actual flight data after flying. I should still have that long spreadsheet somewhere in my files. It covers a few months.

    The criteria I recorded were the forecasted altitudes and the W, updraft velocity.

    Bottom line,

    RASP/Windgrams- mostly under calling,

    Dr Jack/Blip, and XCskies- mostly over calling,

    Windy’s GFS and ECMWF, which was the default back then-hit or miss, ECMWF more misses than GFS. Now they have mblue AI as default and it is always a huge blunder.

    Speaking of XCSkies, they have a feature in the menu, called “conservative lift height”, which I found to be more realistic and accurate. GFS is their default and it is the most accurate. All other models, there are 9 of them, to me are BS, maybe only HRRR rarely on the money for that particular day of flying.

    And when I compare forecasts, I only take the ones that look more or less inline with general consensus, meaning, sometimes one of them would be just plain 100% wrong.

     

     

    #24832
    David Webb
    General Member

    Would be very interested to check out your historical forecast data. In compiling that, were you always recording the forecast data a specific amount of time before the “actual” (for example, did you record the forecast the night before a flying day)? That would definitely factor in.

    Purely anecdotal evidence, but it seems like certain models are “better” for certain sites. I’m sure the weather experts here will light me up for this, but my personal opinion for Marshall seems like that when observing in the evening the following day’s conditions, NAM seems to have been close-ish most of the time on top of lift, and tends to underestimate on wind speed (in a few weeks, a moot point since it’s going away); HRRR tends to read both high and low on top of lift (inconsistent) and slightly overestimates wind speed. GFS seems to only be good at ballpark guesstimations many days out on general wind direction (general “will it be flyable” kinda stuff), but not very useful. ICON and RAP I don’t even bother with, as they don’t seem very useful for the site either.

    I’ve seen others say this about other sites as well, and I tend to agree, and that’s to take NAM and HRRR and take the worse reading of both (so higher wind speed, and lower TOL), plus hope for agreement with them all (agreement being a better signal of accuracy). I heard that RRFS is trending towards “shooting for the middle” between the 2 so far, but time will tell on that.

    Also seems that anytime a significant weather event is nearby (like hurricanes, etc), that messes them all up and you have to take that into account.

    Ok – now everyone can tell me how wrong I am on that. :)

    #24835

    I miss the old BAK40s plots of love. You could load up the truck after the plus 48 said go big.

    #24877
    Alan Crouse
    Premium Member

    RASP/Windgrams have been running on GFS since November 2 as NAM has been retired.

    I’m also looking at using RRFS as a base for a new version.  It may be possible to download, recode/calculate, and plot the RRFS data with no requirement for a model run to rescale/refine the data.  That approach should be made possible by the smaller RRFS grid and considerably faster.  But slow going so far.  Definitely a rainy-day project for the winter months.

    #24878
    David Webb
    General Member

    Thanks for keeping up the good work on this, Alan. Great resource for the community.

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