Home › Forums › Events & Projects › CSS no longer has USHPA insurance.
- This topic has 28 replies, 13 voices, and was last updated 1 month, 1 week ago by Jerome Daoust.
July 15, 2022 at 2:41 AM #16156
We learn here from Marcello:
“We as a club no longer have the USHPA insurance.”
I’m surprised that club members were not involved in deciding this change. It’s OK to explore options, but finalizing is different. CSS leadership often changes, but consequences can be passed on to their replacement and members.
Since the club needs to provide insurance to the DWR (Department of Water Resources) for our LZ, who is the new insurance provider, and can we count on them for 10+ years?
Does the club still require instructors to be part of a PASA school, or require them to hold PL (Professional Liability) insurance (RRRG or other)? Related info… Since May 1st 2022, USHPA instructors (Rogallo members) who operate commercially outside of a PASA school, are no longer covered under USHPA’s PL policy, see their FAQ page (must log in).
Can any instructor (with USHPA rating), now teach (for money) beginning students at the site? Visiting instructors with their P1/P2 students on a road trip welcome?
Extra info I found (source)… The club is no longer an USHPA Chapter, as of June 2021. Chapter level coverage is free for a Chapter for doing the Risk Management work filling. Chapter webinars are available to USHPA members. But CSS canceled their RRRG insurance and USHPA Chapter’s conditional renewal status mid-year 2021 due to not wanting to implement Risk Management corrective actions. One of which was reinstating Local level Accident Reporting and risk mitigation actions. As a result, the CSS (as a Chapter) and landowners at CSS Site Locations do not have USHPA/RRRG insurance as Additional Insured.July 18, 2022 at 4:44 PM #16214
After some questioning (ref), thanks to David who obtained a confirmation (ref) from USHPA, that the club is no longer a Chapter, yet offers the ability to renew…
CSS did not renew their chapter status on the last cycle. Depending on the direction the chapter pursues moving forward, we would be willing to consider their chapter renewal if they applied.July 19, 2022 at 2:23 PM #16225
I’m curious what the benefits of being a USHPA chapter are. I tried having a quick look on their website, but I didn’t see anything that jumped out at me (other than land owner insurance, which we currently have via a different provider): Becoming a USHPA Chapter
If any of you find something you think we could benefit from at AJX by renewing our USHPA Chapter status, please share it here. Their map still has us listed as one of their Chapters, but it hasn’t been updated since 2020.July 19, 2022 at 9:04 PM #16229
Quote from USHPA website:
Chapters are member-controlled organizations approved by the USHPA. They are autonomous, self-governing, financially independent groups of flying enthusiasts, affiliated with the USHPA, who want to share their flying experiences with others.
Update: There is a one-way relationship… A club needs to be a Chapter to get USHPA insurance (for landowners). But a club doesn’t need USHPA insurance to be a Chapter.
Main topic here is: What are the implications of using the current site insurance, compared to one provided by USHPA?
I believe the name of the current site insurance provider was stated by Stan at the end of the 2022/7/16 board meeting. Can the current site insurance policy be posted here for review? It could be an added document under this club website. At the least, it could be good for falling asleep.July 19, 2022 at 9:34 PM #16231
If it helps any, I do remember that the new insurance policy was given to the land owner to review and they had to approve it before the switch happened. As far as I know, their terms were satisfied.July 21, 2022 at 10:10 AM #16245
Not true JeromeJuly 21, 2022 at 10:12 AM #16246
Insurance Certificate is not something we plan to post.July 21, 2022 at 10:13 AM #16247
Correct Jana. Confirmed at the Board Meeting last Saturday by President StanJuly 21, 2022 at 10:15 AM #16248
CSS USHPA dues were paid in March 2021, which took us up through 2022 the renewal date. USHPA never sent the renewal invoice for 2022-2023, although it was requested.July 21, 2022 at 1:29 PM #16253
Thanks for participating Jai Pal, providing extra info (ref) related to being a Chapter or not, and stating (ref) the new insurance name: CGL insurance. Hopefully, we achieve clarity about the club currently being a Chapter or not (taken to a separate discussion), but of greater interest is:
April 13, 2023 at 10:24 PM #17801
- Hopefully this insurance company can be a long-term provider. A lesser issue if there are many to choose from.
- Listing the pros/cons of having selected this insurance provider over the previous, mostly in terms of instruction at the site (likely the driver for the change). I suspect regular pilot members are mostly unaffected. It may be a good decision, but it is best to also provide visibility during a change to club members.
Thanks to Jamie for sharing some details of what the board selected for insurance…
First, the Ranch does NOT have RRRG insurance. When the CSS initially switched from RRRG coverage to a company called Next, they assured the Ranch that it was still covered under the new policy. However, after three months of requests and a great deal of insisting (mostly on my part because I have an extreme distrust of insurance companies), the CSS finally produced a copy of the certificate of additional insurance showing that the Ranch was in fact listed as an additional insured on the policy. But, for the owners of the Ranch, this didn’t provide much assurance that they were protected. So, they insisted on seeing the underlying policy. That was refused for another three months, but eventually the CSS president gave in and provided Owen with a copy of the policy.
Simply put, the policy is garbage. Under “Schedule of Project or Operation” which is where the scope of activities covered is laid out, the policy lists “adult education”. As if this weren’t bad enough, this “adult education” includes “teaching, educating, coaching, or otherwise transferring of knowledge to a client for the purposes of educating that: DO NOT include the practice, instruction, participation, or demonstration of any athletic activity, physical activity, or sport, including but not limited to activity in preparation for or following such activity or sport.”
Under “Exclusions“, section G heading is “Aircraft, Auto or Watercraft” and it excludes “bodily injury or property damage arising out of the ownership, maintenance, use, etc….of any aircraft.”
While I agree with the club leadership that the club doesn’t need insurance and we shouldn’t have to have it, the Water District (landowner) requires it. Even if the CSS is protected by this $238/year policy, there is absolutely no question the Ranch is not and that was confirmed directly by Next.
It was after this discovery and after an unfortunately incident that could very easily have given rise to a claim (but thankfully did not) that the Ranch owners realized they were hugely exposed and were forced to close access to the pond and the 350 launch on the Ranch property until they could secure some kind of protection. They are working on that now.
So, help me understand… How is the DWR (for the LZ) and Forest Service (for launches) satisfied with the policy, if flying is not covered?April 13, 2023 at 11:45 PM #17802
Jerome, to answer your question, I think there two possibilities. Either the DWR hasn’t bothered to actually review the policy – which I think is a distinct possibility. Or, they have reviewed it and they are fine with it.
I don’t know if the forest service requires the club to have insurance.April 14, 2023 at 7:30 AM #17803Tim WardGeneral Member
The Forest Service doesn’t require the club to have insurance. Hang Gliding/Paragliding as an activity is explicitly San Bernardino National Forest’s “15-year plan”.
It’s considered by them to be an activity, just like hiking, fishing, camping, bicycle riding are.April 14, 2023 at 7:45 AM #17804Tim WardGeneral Member
I can tell you one of the aggravating things about being a chapter: USHPA/RRRG endlessly nitpicked language on the site guidelines part of the website.
There wasn’t acceptable boilerplate language supplied by them, it was just a stream of “you shouldn’t say that”, often without any suggestion as to what *would* be acceptable.April 14, 2023 at 12:46 PM #17807
Thank you for that extra info Jamie and Tim: Only the DWR requires insurance, not the Forest Service. And hopefully the DWR reviewed and is satisfied.
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