Just out of curiosity, how often do you fly at AJX and what pattern would you suggest we use for PGs that (in your opinion) would be safer to use with power lines, trees, houses & hang gliders present? Did you watch the video of Stephen’s tandem landing using the approximate pattern? We’re not doing figure 8’s low over the ground. We do them high up, and then bring it in to the grass when we’re about as high as the pine tree that’s by the house.

We’re all open to better ideas, but this has been working out just fine for most of us even with traffic. It’s not very often that we have more than two people coming in to land at about the same time. It’s quite rare and has only happened to me once or twice at the end of the day. When it did, we saw each other, we gave each other room and landed without problems using the figure 8’s. If we don’t have a preferred pattern, how do we all stay predictable to other pilots?

The good news is that the BOD is working on a video that will demonstrate & explain both the HG and PG approach. Hopefully that will help new and visiting pilots better understand why we do what we do at AJX.

I’ve noticed that a few of the older high-risk pilots are staying home and not flying at all. Luckily this is an outdoor activity that (outside of getting a ride up the mountain) is pretty solitary. I believe that anyone taking the Sandy van shuttle up to launch is required to wear a face-mask. She won’t let you ride otherwise, and she’s also limiting the number of people in her van.

It doesn’t seem too difficult to keep a safe distance from other people on the grass, or especially if taking one’s own car up to launch. We have soap and water on site, so washing one’s hands frequently shouldn’t be a problem either.

We definitely would like for everyone to be considerate of others, so yes, please bring a mask even if you think you’re healthy, keep a safe distance from other people when at the LZ, wear your mask when close to others, try not to touch your face and wash those hands. No need to take preventable risks.

I think I was thrown off by the relatively small 8’s in the diagram. In Stephen’s great looking approach, he goes east almost to the training hill, expanding the area covered by almost 50%. In Jana’s description, she mentions going west to the white fence.

The 8s look small in the diagram, but actually cover a pretty good area. I’m usually able to stay within it when making my approach. People don’t need to be making perfect 8s, or turn precisely at the edge of the house, just as long as they’re away from the hang glider training hill and approach. I didn’t want to expand the 8s in the diagram, because I didn’t want people to think it’s OK to expand yet more over the HG training hill. There’s a little bit of wiggle room on that side. The other side has power lines, so when low, I wouldn’t recommend going farther beyond the white fence.

As long as PGs are not flying over the HG training hill and landing on the grass at the base of it, they should be OK. It should be looked at as a ‘guide’ more than a written-in-stone rule. Besides, does nobody else think it’s fun to be able to hit, or at least get close to the PG cone to practice their spot-landings? 😄 That seems a bit tough to do from the HG approach.

This approach pattern is not going to work for everyone ALL the time, but if you watch the wind socks as you approach (when they’re not pointing at each other) and you’re not landing in the middle of a hot day when dust devils are common, this approach pattern will work great and isn’t a risk of you dying if you use it. It’s the only one I’ve been using since I’ve started flying a PG, and I’ve never had an issue with it. I’m out of the way of hang gliders, I’ve not landed into a dust devil (thus far), and haven’t seen anyone else do so yet with my own eyes.

Besides, dust devils don’t just stick to the parking lot area, they’re on the grass too, they just don’t have any dust to pick up to make themselves visible. I’ve seen them go all the way over to the hang glider side. You’re not much safer from them over there, but now you just might get in the way of a hang glider.

Unless you’re great at looking around and making sure no hang gliders are coming in at the same time as you, landing in the hang glider pattern as a PG is asking for problems. There’s a major conflict of speed. HGs are a lot faster than we are, and we can’t get out of their way fast enough. We’ve had way too many of these in the last few months. That’s why the approach pattern keeps coming up. If some of these PGs were good at keeping an eye out, we could easily share the same pattern, but they’re not. They prove it over and over again.

Don’t know if you saw mine, but I have the Ozone light-weight clip version (vs. zipper). It makes my packing life 100% easier, keeps the glider neat when stowed away, and opening it up on launch is no problem. I think the zippers are more prone to break, more expensive, plus there’s the added danger of accidentally getting the glider caught in the zipper. 😓

If anyone here has a passing interest in dust devils or wind gusts…

Uhh that’s meee!!! 😆😜 Seriously though, that’s a crazy spike! I hope I never get caught in something like that. 4:00PM would seem like a ‘safeish’ time to land, but obviously sometimes not so! Terrifying.

@ Jana Pivkova I think you should read what, “John Benario” had to say,(again): — “The page mentions that because of two pilot to pilot lawsuits the RRG is going to run a loss this year, and warns of long term viability because of suits like these. One of the suits being about” “a collision between a kiting glider and a glider coming in to land.

We are not disagreeing on this topic. All of us are advocating for safety and mutual respect. We all want to be able to land safely, wherever that may have to be. That means talking to people who seem not to know any better, and asking them politely to get away from an active landing area. Next time you’re sitting at the LZ watching people kite and you see a problem brewing, please get up and nicely go remind the pilot on the ground to clear the runway. We all need to pitch in to keep everyone safe & happy.

Jana wrote:“Do we then fine hang gliders who can’t land in their own part of the field? Or just paragliders kiting their wing too close to the line”? Seriously? You Really said that?? You honestly think that kiting a PG is more important, than a pilot attempting to Land their glider,(PG or HG)?? Before you answer; re-read what John Benario had to say, above. Do Ya get it now? Because i believe the usage permit that CSS has for their club members ability to fly; i think it’s contingent upon an insurance policy, being in place? What are ya gonna do, when it’s gone? Or maybe you haven’t thought it? If something isn’t done promptly; it is an accident waiting to happen, and another lawsuit, just waiting to take the RRG under. I already have a plan in place, if that happens, and i’m still gonna get to soar gliders legally; what are you going to do?

I believe it was you who began talking about drawing lines onto the grass, fining people and calling the cops for crossing lines. I was merely pointing out the fact that your suggestion was unrealistic and ineffective. I think it’s obvious to most people who read my post, that I ask everyone to keep an eye out and respect each other’s space, especially pilots who are landing. Doesn’t matter what you’re flying.

We need and welcome the newbies, their presence will keep the club going for years to come, but that means there’s a potential element of danger. We can mitigate that danger by working together to educate those who (for whatever reason) missed that part of the lesson. None of us want more incidents or accidents, which means we need everyone to be proactive when we see a potential problem developing.